You are techY podcast

Ellen (00:00):

You are listening to the You are techY podcast, episode number 163.

Voiceover (00:10):

Welcome to the, You are techY podcast where it’s all about growing in your techy-ness. So you can find the tech job of your dreams. And now your host technology learning coach Ellen Twomey.

Ellen (00:27):

Hey moms, are you trying to break into tech? Are you wondering what skills you really need to get hired and how those skills can be worth $45 an hour? Not that $25 an hour you thought when you first started thinking about going back to work? If so, then the You are techY membership is for you. Our combination of courses, coaching and community, come with a mentor support. You need to keep moving forward into your tech career. It’s like no other membership available. We have the exact skills employers are looking for. You learn how to maximize your income with portfolio ready skills that hiring managers are seeking, not to mention the steps you can skip. So you don’t find yourself down that endless tech learning rabbit hole. Join me as we walk you step-by-step through the getting hired process in tech. Sign up at youaretechy.com. That’s Y O U A R E T E C H Y.com. I can’t wait to see you in our membership.

Ellen (01:15):

Welcome to this show where we’re talking about age. So I have my birthday coming up next week and I’ve been thinking a lot about age and one of the, and I’ve been seeing age pop up in my inbox, the topic of age and ageism and how age affects the sector we’re in. And then of course being in technology and hearing the constant drum of youth in technology. Everybody who’s younger is better at technology. So this has just been on my heart and on my mind and with my birthday coming up, I think with most of us when our birthday comes up, there’s this thought that should be another year wiser, right? Like I’ve lived on this planet another year, what exactly did I learn in this last year?

Ellen (02:16):

And there’s this, it can sometimes be a stressful thing that we feel like we aren’t measuring up to some aspect of who we’re supposed to be and the timeframe we’re supposed to be at or that age can somehow prevent us from accomplishing certain goals. So I’ve just been thinking a lot about it. You know, I wanna talk to you a little bit about the concept of age, which is multi-layered for lots of us. So just real quick, check in with yourself. Check in with your body. When I say the word age or my age or your birthday another year older, do you notice any tension anywhere or any sickness in your stomach? Do you notice anything that is impacting you emotionally in a way where you’re thinking, we’re just talking about age. And then when you think about your actual age, so my birthday’s coming up, I’ll be turning 44.

Ellen (03:12):

There could be thoughts about that. Some of you hearing that are thinking that you know exactly what 44 means. You think it’s young, you think it’s old, you think it’s different things based on what your age is. But in my work I come across a lot of differing opinions about age and I wanna share some of them with you with no judgment. I just want you to really look at it from a perspective of look at how we think about age. And then also I think it’s interesting to think about men in age and do they have some of the same thoughts around it? And sometimes they do, but sometimes they don’t. I know the discussion around age feels like women talk about that more. That feels like that feels true to me. I don’t know if that feels true to you, but that’s what feels true in my experience.

Ellen (04:00):

But maybe I’m just drawn to it, especially again, like being in this tech space where people have these preconceived notions that younger people are better at tech. And I wanna talk about that because I just was listening to a podcast the other day and the founder was mentioning how she does not believe that the baby boomer generation is not tech savvy. And I have to agree with her. I mean when I think about what my mom and dad could do when I was in high school and over the years, like think about that. I mean whether you’re, you know, my age or give or take 10 years that that’s probably been some dramatic learning that your parents have had. We didn’t have cell phones, right? We didn’t even have a cell phone. And now I mean please my parents have to tell them to get off their phone.

Ellen (04:49):

They’re on it all the time and making trades from their phone and keeping in contact with old friends on their phone. I mean, so anyway, I thought it was really astute what this founder was saying about the baby boomer generation. And I think it’s really important for all of us to think about that, think about these preconceived notions that people who are younger are better at technology. And a lot of that has to do with exposure. Well, they grew up with it, yes, but they grew up using it and that doesn’t always mean they understand how it is created. So think about the difference between created and using it. If you’re thinking that I’m going to give you like I’m a year, another year older, so I’m going to talk about what I’ve learned in my 44 years or the wisdom that I’ve gained in the last year, I’m not going to do that.

Ellen (05:35):

Maybe that’s the wisdom I’ve gained is that I, you know, I share a lot of things that I learn talking to amazing women, working to break into tech, working to build companies, working to just do amazing things in this world. And it’s such an honor to share some of their learnings and my to be, you know, a guest on their journey. It’s just, it’s such an honor and a blessing. If I have anything interesting to talk about that you wanna hear, that is why I don’t have really any wisdom or nuggets to share with you except I wanna share some things that I’ve read and come across people I’ve talked to about this topic because I think it’s relevant and helpful. Some of them are more formalized than others. So one thing that I want to share with you is a woman who posted on social media that she was 31 and she was wondering if she was too old to break into tech.

Ellen (06:27):

Okay, I’m gonna laugh with you. So there’s no judgment of course. Like she’s nine years into her career. I think about that when you’re 22 and you’re like nine years into career. I remember being 22 thinking, man, when I am nine years into my career, I’m gonna be really far along. I can totally see where she would say that. But of course like my students who are in their fifties are laughing, they’re like, are you kidding? Of course not. You have so much life to live. But that is a thought and I am sure that if that one woman asked that question, many others have that same thought, like, am I too old to do this? So the answer is no. <laugh>, you’re wondering. But I will say I don’t really ever think about whether I’m too old to do things. And I don’t know if it’s because I took a break, I just took a break staying home with the four kids and renovating a house and whatever.

Ellen (07:16):

I took a career break, not really, cuz I started a company learner programming language. But in my mind I took a career break, a formal career break and it never occurred to me, I guess when I was returning I did feel a little bit of sense of like, I better hurry up, but that’s the only time I’ve really ever felt, whew, the door is closing on this. I don’t know why that is. I think part of it is my mentality. I think part of it is I’m neurotic about my diet. I’m like literally neurotic about my diet. I know people say like stay healthy and I also do exercise but not nearly the balance that I used to. I used to be pretty good about my health and exercise all the time and now I’m really good about my like what I eat and I do very minimal exercises and very like focused.

Ellen (08:00):

And I share that with you because the energy difference when you eat the right foods is completely different. And so I do think that is a factor in how I don’t really ever think about age. So I would say to you like that is something to take a look at. Is there some way that you are feeling tired or old? You’re saying, I’m old, but you’re feeling tired. Is there something in your diet that you can change? And then I’m gonna say the thing I do tell my kids all the time, which is drink water. And I know they’re like, oh mom, good more sleep, drink water. I get it. But if you would like to play this for your children, maybe your children will listen to me and then you can say it to my children and they’ll listen to you. You know how that works.

Ellen (08:41):

So think about that in terms of if you’re physically feeling old, consider whether your health and your diet are a factor in it. I’m not a health expert, I’m not here to share everything with you, but I can tell you that you know, if you’re intaking high quantities of sugar that makes you feel tired and when you’re dragging, then you feel old. And that is a factor in that process. So consider that. And also just if you are considering that, just do it at a phased approach. Do it in a phased approach. Don’t try to do the cold Turkey thing. Doesn’t work. Try to too many times. Okay? Those are some of the things to consider when you’re looking at your thoughts around age. Now if you’re thinking I’m gonna talk about like ageism in the workplace or how people are impacted by age, I would just say to you, there are a few things you can do show up energetically in your interviews.

Ellen (09:29):

That is a great thing to do. And if you 10 or more years, then I can’t promise you that every person is not going to judge you based on your age. But if they do challenge them and say, you know, a lot of times younger people are going to hop around and I have 10 or more years to dedicate to you, that’s a huge cost saving right now in this space because I don’t care to jump around. I care to find a job that I love and do that for the next 10 years. So that’s a great pitch in something that you can use to combat ageism. The other thing I would say on that is if someone is judging you based on your age, it’s unlikely that’s gonna be a good fit for you. It’s just probably not a good fit. So consider that you could move on and you might say that and that’s not right or that’s, well those, that’s a separate topic that you have every right to look at and see if you wanna devote your time and energy to it.

Ellen (10:22):

But when you’re focused on getting hired, that’s what you want. You want everything going towards getting hired. So maybe there, there’s a different separate time to address that, even if it is an injustice, even if it is an injustice, navigating that is going to be a helpful component, you know of that. And you’re, remember you are evaluating them as much as they are evaluating you. So consider that’s a screening process. And if they tend to be judging you based on, or you feel like you’re being judged based on ageism, maybe ask the question. But if you show up energetically, I think that is a great way to combat ageism. Okay, the next thing I wanna share with you on age was, so Whitney Johnson is a fantastic podcaster. She was a guest on our podcast episodes 95 and 96. You are techie.com/ 95, you are techie.com/ 96.

Ellen (11:10):

It’s one of my favorite combo episodes. But go ahead and check out her Disrupt Yourself podcast. It’s fantastic. Get on her email list. So quick plug, join Whitney’s email list. In a recent email she talked about getting advice from younger people and you know, we often think about older people giving advice and you know, we can shepherd these younger people, but I thought the email was really well, it’s always well ridden. She’s a fantastic writer, she’s also an author. But it was also conceptually just a great difference in thinking from the way that we normally think about things, right? So like we are wise and we shepherd our children and we were mentor to other people, but what about someone younger than you? What about them being a mentor to you? Consider that. So if you’re younger, that doesn’t mean you can’t mentor someone older.

Ellen (12:03):

And so a recent, it was funny, it was kind of serendipitous that she sent that email because recently someone that I’ve worked with for a long time who’s about a decade younger than me, and when I say about, I mean a little bit more, but I have often given him, you know, like just mothering self-care advice and hey, what about this and what about that? And it was really funny because Lee, he had been giving me self-care advice and saying, well, did you try this? And did you read this book? And think about that. And I mean, it was fantastic advice. It was really great. So it was just serendipitous that Whitney was talking about it and I thought, I didn’t tell, you know, I didn’t joke with him a little bit like how, how tables have turned. But really it felt very natural to receive advice from someone that I knew had success in this one area.

Ellen (12:51):

And only because the tables have been turned. And I really find it interesting, funny, amusing maybe, but like really he, it’s no big deal. Like it’s, it makes sense that he would have advice to give me, I mean, people in their thirties have lived a lot of life. They have great experiences to share. And so I, I say that because when you’re thinking about age and the roles that we play, it’s really as straightforward as people who are older are helpful and wise until they retire. And then people who are younger are impulsive. And these are just thoughts and stereotypes that we’ve been working with and and aren’t really necessarily, they’re not even generally true and they’re for sure not individually true on a case by case basis. So even if you consider yourself to be someone who is pretty old or too young to do something or you’re too old and slow, these are thoughts that you can challenge that, that are for sure not serving you.

Ellen (13:53):

And kind of wrapping it back into this tech aspect, that when you are in technology and you think technology moves at such a fast pace, that is not always true. Some technology moves very fast, the majority of the middle technology moves medium and there’s plenty of technology that moves very archaically and slowly. So I wanna challenge you that if you are thinking that you are someone who is, you know, older and slower, let’s just say old and slow, those are, that’s something that you can often think about. Then what I really wanna challenge you with is that you are not paid to be fast as a UX designer or a developer. You are paid to solve problems and to think, and your experiences and connection building through those experiences are what will serve you and your speed will be less important. Knowing the right things to focus on will be very important.

Ellen (15:00):

So I really want you to challenge your thinking around what technology means and just focus on the one skillset that you are learning. Focus on the UX process. Focus on the development process. The way that you will gain speed is to gain it. As you gain connections and individual problems that you are solving, you will repeatedly come across the same problem or an adjacent problem or a new problem. And those will enable you to build your learning. And then also you will be able to identify that situation again. That will be the speed that you bring typing faster or moving from screen to screen. That’s really going to be an effective building strategy. So keep in mind you’re being paid to think. And so challenge that thinking around technology moves so fast, right? And your age around it. Okay, so kind of tying this back into my birthday and what I’ve decided to do for my birthday is to take a week off of podcasting.

Ellen (16:05):

I’m going to give myself a week off when we do weeks off, we do encore episodes or we only take a break at the end of the year and we produce so many podcasts. My team does an amazing job. Thank you so much for all you do team. And I’ve decided, I don’t know if this is wisdom or not, maybe this is the wisdom I’m giving, but I’ve decided that more is not better. And so I’m taking next week off of podcasting and I’m planning to take one week off a quarter, one week off a quarter. So that’s what I’m thinking. And that’s kind of the plan for 2023. We kinda look at the overall calendar and think about that. And so more is not better. What I want to encourage you to do is to re-listen to a podcast that was really meaningful for you, or maybe it helped you jumpstart your career, or maybe it helped you jumpstart before you joined the membership.

Ellen (17:02):

Listen to it again now after there’s time has passed a few weeks, months, or years. And listen again and see, have you changed? Do you have a different perspective? Do the words mean something different to you now? Because I think it’s very important to revisit and to go over and we don’t always take the time to do that. So I wanna invite you next week to pick a podcast that was meaningful for you and listen to that one. And hey, since you’re doing that, maybe share why it was meaningful to you. I think that, you know, not everyone is ready to break into tech. They’re still kind of thinking about it. Not everyone has it in the budget to join the membership and they really need free resources to really get them on their way. So it’d be amazing if you would share it, but I really hope that you’ll take the time to listen to a podcast that you’ve listened to before and it was meaningful to you and see how much you have changed.

Ellen (17:55):

Maybe journal on it, <laugh>. But anyway, I hope you guys enjoyed this episode about age, whatever age you were super young. I am super young. We’re super young together and there’s lots of time left for us to do great things. I’ll see you.

Ellen (18:08):

Hey if you enjoyed listening to this podcast you have to sign up for the You are techY email list. Imagine being in the tech job of your dreams. Join me to get the strategies training and never-ending support to get hired. Sign up at youaretechy.com. That’s Y O U A R E T E C H Y.com. I’ll see you next time.